MEETING MINUTES – AUG, 10, 2011
CRIME PREVENTION AND SAFETY COMMITTEE
&
LONG TERM PLANNING & PROPERTY STANDARDS COMMITTEE
Attending: Sharon, Ben, Mike, Karen, Meredith, Jack, Stephen & ?
Minutes prepared by Ben, and include personal observations as well as details of the meeting.
Prior to the meeting Stephen had outlined his problems with through the week with noise from the downtown bars, and the response time by the Barrie Police. He is unaware if charges were laid or tickets issued, but it seems remote.
At the meeting called by the City Clerk to discuss the new long form questionnaire to be submitted with liquor licence applications there was discussion about the police not logging charges against the bars so that the fines never escalate above step 1. At that time I requested that the 2 senior officers present look into that situation and create a file which would be available to responding officers so that repeat offenders would be treated to increased deterrents. They indicated that they would investigate that situation. To my knowledge, they have not followed through on that commitment.
Sharon called the meeting to order at 07:05 P.M.
Immediately after opening the meeting, the floor was turned over to our guest, City Clerk, Dawn McAlpine. Dawn told us of some of the successes and failures of communication between groups such as the BDNA, the City, and the Alcohol and Gaming Commission. She handed us copies of the AGCO: Services For You – Liquor Sales Licences – Risk Based Conditions. Risk Based Conditions are a recently introduced change in policy for the AGCO. Items of particular interest to us are as follow:
The holder of the licence shall file in writing with the Registrar of Alcohol and Gaming by Date the measures that the holder has in place to deter disorderly conduct on property adjacent to and in the vicinity of the premises and to minimize damage, nuisance or other harm to such property arising out of disorderly conduct engaged in by patrons or persons attempting or waiting to enter the premises or leave the premises.
The holder of the licence shall not provide or permit music or other forms of entertainment in outdoor areas.
The holder of the licence shall not provide or permit amplified music or other forms of entertainment in outdoor areas.
The holder of the licence shall ensure that no live or amplified music is played in the licensed outdoor area(s) past the time designated by the Registrar of Alcohol and Gaming.
The holder of the licence shall ensure that the areas adjacent to and within XY metres of the premises are kept clean and free from any garbage associated with the operation of the premises and patrons.
The holder of the licence shall ensure that there is a designated and supervised area for smokers that does not adversely affect property adjacent to the premises.
There are a great many conditions, all of which may be read at the AGCO web address below:
http://www.agco.on.ca/en/services/conditions_riskbased_LSL.aspx
Dawn has suggested that we, when requesting limitations on a licence, or registering objections to same, reference these clauses. The AGCO may place more weight on our requests if the requests are more easily referenced and understood by them.
The following is a link to the AGCO site that lays out the people per area allowed.
http://www.agco.on.ca/pdfs/en/guides/1214_a.pdf
It states that the allowable number of people is established in 1 of three ways i.e.
2. There are three methods of assigning a capacity to
your establishment, either:
a) capacity is assigned by the building department; or
b) capacity is assigned by the fire department; or
c) capacity is calculated by an architect or professional engineer.
The sample looks at total area, and does not take into account fixtures such as a bar, tables, game boards or other fixtures that occupy floor space which is shown as available for human movement. As well, I (personal opinion) seem to remember Dawn indicating that the AGCO seemed o disregard the recommendation of the Building & Fire Departments and applied it’s own standard to the capacity of an establishment, which, if true, would be in direct defiance of their published policy.
If the approximate standard of 1.15 m2 per person is being applied without regard to fixtures, then perhaps it is time for the AGCO to examine its policy.
Also the AGCO does not supply feedback to the City or to the BDNA on the results of license applications. It might be appropriate for the AGCO to at least let the City know what is going on.
Dawn also indicated that Barrie is one of only a handful of communities to ask license applicants to fill out a form to submit with the application, and ours is the most detailed form in use.
The City Clerk’s presentation ended at approximately 08:15 P.M.
It was noted that the ‘Minimum Separation Bylaw for Bars’ was still being researched. There was a question about the status of the requested ‘Minimum Separation Bylaw’ for boarding and rooming houses. This was a project of Cindy’s, and in her absence (she’ll be back next month) Ben indicated that he would follow up, and report back to us next meeting (September 14).
The video camera project has received favourable reviews by the Police Department and City Council. All that remains now is for them to develop a concrete plan and cost , and allocate funds. We will continue to follow up on this project. There is a police board meeting August 25 at 4 P.M. Perhaps there will be something to report after the meeting.
We will continue our efforts to ameliorate the CNCC drop off situation at the Barrie bus terminal downtown. We recognize that if the main terminal is moved as per plan and if the one roof concept actually happens the situation will be altered, but those items are 2 to 5 years in the offing, and we cannot afford to wait that long if we wish to rejuvenate the Downtown.
We also need to motivate panhandlers, prostitutes and defilers of public spaces to remove themselves from the Downtown core. These people can be seen on a daily basis. This can only be accomplish by the Police Department applying due diligence.
The next meeting will be Wednesday, September 14 at the Steckley-Gooderham Funeral Home on Worsley Street – 7:00 P.M.
BARRIE - Members of the Barrie Police Services Board want to install 10 cameras downtown at a cost of $300,000.
Mayor Jeff Lehman told the board Tuesday PowerStream is willing to install the cameras at no cost.
He was also hopeful a service group like Rotary might participate by funding all or part of the equipment costs.
“As mayor, there have been a number of groups interested in fixing up a park or playground,” said Lehman, adding maybe they’d be willing to contribute to community safety too.
Lehman was surprised with the community’s support for a surveillance camera project.
“I thought it would be more controversial. But if the police service feels it would be an asset to tackle the issues downtown, then I’m supportive of it,” he said.
Lehman wanted full disclosure on the cost of the cameras, including the cost of the manpower needed to use the system.
“There will be an impact to the Barrie Police Service if we install cameras, including ongoing maintenance and securing video if it’s going to be used in an evidentiary circumstance,” said Chief Mark Neelin.
He expects a few officers will be required to train others with the initial setup, for things like making sure cameras are facing the right way while recording.
After the first two months, Neelin expects the operating costs to decrease.
He stressed to Lehman that the camera costs will be a reason he’ll ask for more money next year.
“We would keep this as a separate item in the operating budget for 2012, because we want to be able to point out the cost of the cameras,” said Neelin.
Council gave initial approval for the meeting on Monday.
Residents, business people and developers will be asked for their input about new zoning regulations for restaurants, bars, taverns and nightclubs as set out in a staff report received by councillors. But before nightclubs can be regulated, they have to be defined, said Coun. Lynn Strachan, whose ward includes the downtown area.
"Currently, a nightclub is not defined in any zoning bylaw," she said.
"We want to set up a definition which would help us regulate where they go in the city. We want to ensure there are not too many in the downtown area and to ensure they're not within 200 metres of residential areas."
The report also suggested nightclubs have a maximum capacity of 600 people (including a patio) and be at least 200 metres from another nightclub.
Ben Strudwick, co-chairman of the Barrie Downtown Neighbourhood Association, said the group is in favour of regulating any new nightclubs.
"We don't want anymore large bars downtown. They already have a maximum capacity of 6,200 leaving the bars at closing time," he said. "That's an awful lot of people to be let out at the same time in a concentrated area.
"It's noisy, it's not very friendly and it leads to confrontations between patrons exiting the bars."
Strudwick says the noise from downtown patios and bars is already "cheek and jowl with downtown residents," noting residential towers along Dunlop and Bayfield streets will soon be joined by another development across from the bus station and two eight-storey buildings — which will include 150 condominiums, a grocery store, and a retail component that will include a bank and office space — at the northeast corner of Collier and Mulcaster streets.
"The noise concern is one we're on about at the moment. If you're going to have residents downtown, you have to enforce the bylaws," Strudwick said. "Many of the bars have been very co-operative, so it's been successful to a point."
But there are still issues with some of the establishments, he added.
Smaller watering holes are not the issue, Strudwick said.
"We're not against the local kind of pub that has 30 or 40 people or plaza bars. We're against large bars in close proximity to each other," he said. "We want to leave space between them to diversify and invite other small shop owners to the area.
"We need little shops to attract people downtown."
Strudwick says the association is also concerned about future development on Bradford Street.
"We don't want Bradford Street to turn into another Dunlop Street. The density of people is there and the opportunity is there for big bar businesses," he said. "With some controls going in place, the city can control the growth in that area."
Strachan says the city intends to do that.
"There are a lot of opportunities on Bradford Street. It is critical in the development of the downtown and city centre," she said. "We have to make sure it's the right mix of uses.
"If the changes (to the zoning bylaw) were passed, it would ensure we don't have any nightclubs on Bradford Street. They'd be too close to residents," she said, alluding to people living in nearby condos or homeowners on residential streets in the area.
Strachan says certain areas of the city are developing their own character.
Collier Street is an area of legal professionals, Dunlop Street is for entertainment, bars and shopping and Bradford Street would be a transitional area with mixed uses of residential and retail.
"It behooves us to improve the downtown so its residents and the increased density of people there have some place to walk and shop," Strudwick said.
The public meeting to gather input about zoning bylaw changes is likely to take place in the late fall or early winter, according to clerk Dawn McAlpine.
imcinroy@thebarrieexaminer.com
Crime Prevention, Safety and Long Term Planning Meeting
Wednesday, Aug. 10 - 7 p.m.
Agenda
Chair: Sharon
Secretary: Irene
1. Minutes of July 13.11.
2. Dawn McAlpine, City Clerk
- Liquor License Applications- comments & concerns (&requests to city hall)
. how to respond, what things to mention, how to phrase letter to be effective
3. Follow-up - Minimum distance for bars/taverns & rooming houses downtown.
Lynn Strachan, Councellor Ward 2.
4. Video Cameras – letter to Council/Police Services - update.
5. Next candidate for upcoming provincial election ? NDP candidate?
Barrie Crime Prevention , Safety and Long Term Planning Meeting
July 13, 2011
Present: Bryan, Steve, Irene, Ben, Stephen, Jack, Justin, Mike, Lynn
Meeting called to order @ 7:00pm
1. Minutes of June 15, 2011 adopted and posted.
2. Boarding and Rooming house minimum separation distance by-law report is being worked on but no specifics as this time, working with property standards on the amount of people in the rooming house with bathroom facilities to include health issues and fire safety.
3. Video Camera update – We want the cameras to be public, not police cameras, need to have policy, procedures and the economics of the cameras and submit letter to Barrie council along with BIA support. Police Services Board passed the motion for cameras with all the cost for 10 to 15 cameras and submit to the City
4. Bar Noise Update – Capacity of patrons is defined by the Fire Dept. According to the square feet. The AGC issues licence for patio. Building code establishes the amount of people. The Bar noise level at 11:00pm is getting better and is sporadic. No resident can make a complaint before 11:00pm.
5. Webb site cost is $35.00 short.
6. New Business – New ideas are needed to improve the downtown. Need one place for Social Services and stop the Drop off from Penetang.
7. Next Meeting at Community Health Centre on Aug. 10, 2011 at 7:00pm
8. Meeting adjourned at 8:10pm
Barrie Crime Prevention, Safety and Long Term Planning Committee
Meeting Minutes - JUNE 15, 2011
MEETING BEGAN @ 7:00 PM
PRESENT: Sharon, Steve, Jack, Ben, Irene, Kelly, Justin, Janet, Amber,
Guest: Andrew Miller
1. Minutes of May 11, 2011 passed.
2. Andrew Miller is the Green Party Candidate for Barrie in the Provincial Election this fall
Mr. Miller lives downtown and runs a local business called Back to Basics. Green party platform
Includes – job creation, safe affordable energy, quality health care close to home, supporting local
farmers and food production and a transparent and open government.
With Trillium grant he started 5 community gardens. Working to find a new home for the Busby
Centre and other social service agencies. Creating jobs by starting a small lawn care & bicycle
repair and messenger business. The Arts, Food and Music Studio is opening on July 15th on
Toronto Street. Artists to give workshops. He showed examples of how shipping containers can
be used as homes and offices.
Mr. Miller also on many local committees – i.e. Georgian College, City of Barrie
He feels more resources are needed for prevention and to attract more doctors and Nurse
Practitioners to Health Care.
Website: www.backtobasicscanada.com. Also on Facebook and Twitter.
3. Boarding &Rooming Houses – Jack
There was a discussion of the 0 need for separation distance for boarding and rooming houses.
This includes a review of standards for fire and health codes as we have a large number of
transient people. Cindy has done work in this area and should be involved in any future
discussions
4. Video Camera - information meeting held at City Hall. A report will be written.
5. Bar Noise - BIA is behind the noise by-law.
6. BDNA interested in hearing from the NDP and Liberal Candidates platforms. No candidates
Selected at this time.
7. Next meeting will be held Wed July 13th, 2011 at 7:00 pm - Ben to chair person. Will let everyone
Know location.
8. Meeting adjourned at 8:30pm.
Thanks to all who helped along the way.
___________________________________________________________________________________
Security cameras in downtown Barrie have the green light.
The city's police board gave initial approval Tuesday to the project, which has a starting cost of about $300,000.
"There is interest in the community to have these cameras installed," Police Chief Mark Neelin said.
"I've been surprised at how overwhelming support has been," Mayor Jeff Lehman said. "I think we have a sense of what level of interest there is in the community."
Community response was measured through phone calls, e-mails, surveys and media polls, and 62% of those who responded were in favour of having security cameras downtown.
The Downtown BIA has already endorsed the concept.
Neelin will come back to the police board with some hard numbers on what staffing, monitoring and maintenance costs would be for 10 to 12 cameras in the downtown, then the matter would go to city council, possibly as early as Aug. 8.
The police board gave unanimous approval to a motion Tuesday that it endorses installing security cameras in the downtown — if they can be funded with an acceptable impact on the police operating budget.
Lehman said this would be considered a service level increase by Barrie police, something that is considered by council in city departments on a regular basis.
Neelin said security cameras would increase demands on the police information technology staff. But the security cameras wouldn't be actively viewed by police and set to monitor a general area. They wouldn't always be in the same location, either. The police communications centre would have a monitor and staff would be able to watch it.
There would have to be someone responsible to make sure the system functions properly, the necessary records are maintained, maintenance is done and footage is retrieved, as required.
"While I have not found any hard statistics to relate to a percentage drop in the crime rate in the monitored areas, the feeling is that the cameras do assist in deterring crime," Neelin said. "There have been some crimes which have been solved with the assistance of the video."
City police looked at security cameras in Sudbury, Sturgeon Falls, London, Windsor, Toronto, Trenton, Cobourg and Cornwall.
While the city would be responsible for costs associated with the cameras, that price could be offset by provincial funding through the proceeds-of-crime grants and private/public partnerships.
Lehman said a number of city groups have approached him about helping with community projects, and this could be one. The mayor also said PowerStream might be able to help with the installation, as the cameras would be in elevated positions.
Last summer, the police board instructed Neelin to investigate security cameras, in consultation with the Downtown Barrie Neighbourhood Association and the Downtown Barrie BIA. How many cameras would be used, where they would go, how they would be deployed and cost were all to be part of the chief's investigation.
Many private businesses already use video cameras inside their buildings and on their property for security reasons. Police also use these recorded images to investigate crimes and possibly identify suspects.
Barrie's Transit Terminal had 10 security cameras installed at its Maple Street building a few years ago. Cabling, digital equipment and computer monitors are also part of the system.
The security camera images at the bus station are recorded, but not constantly monitored. There are also security personnel at the downtown terminal.
The city also has security cameras — about 50 — in its Collier Street parking garage. Their images are also just recorded and not actively monitored.
In 2001, the city looked at installing video surveillance cameras in the downtown area. But conflicting federal and provincial positions on the legality of surveillance, even in high-crime areas, and the potential for court challenges in cities where cameras are already used, stopped the plans.
bbruton@thebarrieexaminer.com
Crime Prevention, Safety and Long Term Planning Meeting
Wednesday, June 15 - 7 p.m.
Agenda
Chair: Sharon
Secretary: Jayne
1. Minutes of May 11. 11 passed.
2. Andrew Miller – Green Party Candidate for Barrie
- for the Provincial Election this fall.
3. Upgrading current standards for boarding and rooming houses
- separation bylaw
4. Updates:
5. Next candidate for upcoming provincial election ?
Smile, you could soon be on a surveillance camera.
Barrie police want to find out how residents feel about the installation of the cameras in problem areas downtown.
To that end, they held open discussions at City Hall on Tuesday about the use of surveillance cameras, and whether they should be used at all.
It's a no-brainer for Ben Strudwick, of the Barrie Downtown Neighbourhood Association, who thinks they're a great idea.
"I believe the cameras would be a deterrent to some mischief makers, would help identify some perpetrators of mischief and would help to create an umbrella of safety downtown," he said. "They would be another tool in the arsenal of the police to assist in maintaining order downtown."
Shelley-Ann Maxwell isn't so sure the cameras are a tool the police should have, however.
"It's a problem when the state would want to surveil us through the use of cameras. It treats the citizenry as if they were suspects," she said. "It goes against our basic rights to freedom and is the beginning of a slippery slope."
Maxwell said surveillance cameras don't necessarily mean safer streets.
"Our police force is doing a good job, I feel safe downtown," she said. "We're under surveillance enough and it gives us a false sense of security."
"There are no statistics that say (it increases safety)," she added.
Barrie police Chief Mark Neelin agrees there are no definitive statistics to prove how effective cameras are, but has talked to officials from other municipalities who say they work.
"From other communities I've looked at and police chiefs I've spoken with, they all report an increase in the feeling of security," he said. "People feel there are additional eyes monitoring the area."
Neelin said he wants to hear from citizens and whether they would like to see the cameras installed.
"If they do, the next phase will be to look at a funding model," he said, adding it would be up to the Barrie Police Services Board to decide if the cameras are warranted, and then up to city council to decide whether or not to fund them. He said a ballpark figure for the cameras would be about $30,000 each, but that is very preliminary and before any costing has been done.
The city would pay for the cameras and the private sector, service clubs, and various grant agencies could also be tapped for money.
"I would like to get a report to the (police) board this month and then they'll review it," Neelin said, adding it would be up to the board to decide where the cameras would be placed.
The cameras would be placed in strategic areas downtown and could be relocated if necessary, he added.
"There would be passive monitoring of the cameras. No one would be dedicated to watching them," the chief said, adding they would allow police to investigate crimes that are recorded.
There is currently no legislation in Canada addressing the use of surveillance cameras. They would not be able to look into businesses or private residences and they wouldn't have audio monitoring capability.
Strudwick said he'd like to see them used to monitor activity around downtown bars, as well as "shadowy" areas like alleyways where there is the potential for drug dealing or prostitution.
"If the downtown is to be revitalized, we must start with a perception of change and safety. Cameras will help to create that perception," he said.
imcinroy@thebarrieexaminer.com